This is a Raven Arms P25 MP25, a good example of a .25 caliber handgun. But is it a bad example of a handgun for writing fiction? (Image via Wikimedia, public domain)
TLDR: If you can help it, a character might be better off with a handgun with more bite than a .25 caliber.
Last week’s post about the .25 caliber “lady’s gun” used by James Bond kicked off some interesting feedback from followers of this blog. Some agreed with my take that the ability to be accurate matters more than firepower (a perennial debate in the gun world, too). Others felt .25 caliber handguns are flat out a bad option despite how easy they are to shoot.
Characters in fiction can get away with plenty those in the real world can’t, so neither POV is completely right or wrong. It’s up to writers to make the final call.
Still, I feel like I didn’t give enough time in that post to why it might be a bad idea to go with a .25 caliber, especially since there’s plenty of anecdotal evidence.
.25 Caliber Pistols: A Glorified Pea Shooter
In my book, The Writer’s Guide to Weapons (Writer’s Digest Books), crime writer and ex-con (I say that in the best way possible) Les Edgerton talks about a gunfight he took part in with a friend. The friend used a Raven .25 caliber, similar to the one in the video above. Here’s what Edgerton wrote:
“Rat had one of those pesky little Raven .25 calibers, and I had a .38 revolver. I kept telling him to get rid of that little toy. If he ever shot anyone with it, it was just going to piss them off, plus it left [empty casings] lying around.”
As Edgerton points out, the issue with the .25 is how it’s underpowered compared to other calibers. A check of the ballistics tables in my copy of Gun Digest 2015 shows how the .25 is slower than a .22, despite having a larger bullet than the latter. It’s like building a larger car with a smaller engine.
The combination of a relatively large bullet with less energy behind it means it won’t hit as hard, hence Edgerton’s comment that the .25 “was just going to piss them off.”
It turns out he’s right.
What It’s Like to be Shot by a .25 Caliber Handgun
An anonymous source contact me earlier this week to share three separate incidents where the people shot by a .25. I couldn’t confirm the identity of this person, but I still think there’s merit to these stories.
Thankfully, everyone lived in this first story, although the violent encounter is still disturbing:
This first guy I knew [who was] shot with a .25 was a kid on my high school wrestling team. He confronted another kid near the projects in outside Las Vegas, NV. The kid pulled a pistol and fired one shot first.
My teammate’s friends scattered. My teammate yelled out something like, “Why are you running? It’s not real.” (He had been hit in the sternum near his heart). After he yelled at his friends for running, he charged the shooter still thinking the gun was fake.
The kid then shot my teammate again, hitting his cheek bone below his eye, at which time he realized he had been shot and covered his face with his arms. The kid fired again and struck him in the elbow. The bullets never penetrated his skull or sternum but did cause some fractures from what I remember.
This next story involves someone the source worked with in the military who was on leave. The money quote: “He was shot on a Saturday night and was at work on Monday.”
One weekend he was with his friends when they had a run in with some gangsters. Words were exchanged and he got into a little Honda Civic with four other guys and tried to leave. The gangsters blocked them in, and one gangster charged their car with a pistol out.
Everyone in the car scrambled out the passenger door. My buddy said he just started hauling ass when he heard the shots. He didn’t realize he was hit at first, just like my wrestling teammate a few years earlier. He said he thought he was making a good distance running as fast as he could but when he opened his eyes (yes, he was running at a full sprint with his eyes closed) he realized he was on the ground.
Now I know there is time distortion in critical incidents, so I don’t know how long it took him to realize he was doing the Curly Shuffle, but he said he opened his eyes and could see only one leg really moving. He had been shot in the hip and tricep about 20 feet from the car.
He was taken to the hospital, where the doctors used what he said were tweezers (I think it was some other instrument) to remove the bullet lodged in his tricep. They left the bullet in his hip because of where it was located.
He was shot on a Saturday night and was at work on Monday.
The final story involves a detective hosting a law enforcement training to the source about stabbings. The detective said he’d rather be shot than stabbed, and relayed a story about a criminal using a .25.
He explained while he was on the job he got into a confrontation with a suspect. During the scuffle, the guy pulled out a little silver automatic. The detective said he let the guy go and held his arm straight out, palm up, just out of instinct. He said he heard a pop and the guy ran off.
Then he said he felt the pain in his palm like he had placed his hand with full weight on a nail. The bullet hit him in the heel of the palm of the hand and didn’t even break a bone.
He said he was extremely lucky and explained he thought the .25 was infective round because it had the same amount of powder as a .22, but because the size of the bullet was larger, it didn’t have the penetrating velocity.
If They’re No Good, Why Would Anyone Use a .25 Caliber Handgun?
They’re cheap and easy to find. That’s the primary reason. This is one of the quintessential “Saturday Night Special” guns.
The second reason is they’re easy to shoot and conceal. This makes them ideal for backup guns, but perhaps not primary, as depicted in this clip from Dr. No:
Should Your Characters Use a .25?
My default in these conversations is that any firearm can be lethal, which is why in the real world they deserve respect. Would I want to be shot by a .25 to prove a point? Not if I can help it.
If your character has no other option, a .25 is better than a ham sandwich. If you can help it, though, you might want to go with these tried and true substitutes:
- .45 caliber semi-automatic pistol
- .40 caliber semi-automatic pistol
- 9mm semi-automatic pistol
- .38 caliber revolver
- .357 caliber revolver
Get the Book
The Writer’s Guide to Weapons: A Practical Reference for Using Firearms and Knives in Fiction (Writer’s Digest Books) comes with everything but the ammo. Pick up a print or digital copy from these fine retailers:
The Writer's Guide to Weapons 
I have no reason to doubt any of this; however, I read this somewhere about the .25 caliber: “The slugs will ricochet around inside the head. It’s like putting the victim’s brain in a blender.”
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That speaks to how underpowered the .25 can be, in that it can struggle to make an exit. Doesn’t make it more or less deadly, though, because being shot in the head will always suck.
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People say the same about .22, and it’s what I often call Fuddlore. It’s an attempt to justify a bad choice through the construction of mythical properties around it. Both .22LR and .25ACP will penetrate the cranium at close range. Both can in fact kill quite easily. But they don’t ricochet around like a pinball, the lead fragments and those fragments disperse their energy quickly within the matter of the brain, killing IF they happen to end up in the right spot.
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A .25 is different from a .22 LR as it has a full metal jacket.having, thankfully,never seen a .25 fired into a human skull I can’t say for sure but I doubt that it would fragment.death was be the most likely result.if a .177 air rifle can go through a skull a .25 would have no problems.
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If I were in a position that to defend myself to preserve my life I’ll be close enough that a co2 pellet pistol will stop attacker. Shooting the incredible Hulk at arm length with even a co2 vb pistol 18 rounds in eyes ears mouth will kill disable or deter even the Hulk long enough for me to run to safety. Much more than arms length unless a public attack on crowd shouldn’t require lethal means. In saying such I’ve owned almost every known pistol that is cost worthy not talking bout some umrwal collector item I love all caliber handguns but do not enjoy the larger cal. Because it’s has way to much recoil to be accurate unless many hrs of practice first
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Ppl dont understand that reg. bullets r for target practice n there other types of bullets like zombie tip(R.I.P. Bullets), fmj, hollow points, incendiary rounds.
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Not the type of gun but how u use it
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Not really. If you use a .45 and a .25 the same exact way, the .45 will be MUCH deadlier.
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Depends where the projectile hits the person.In the chest a .45 will probably be deadlier than a .25 but it the bullet goes into the brain 🧠 sort of irrelevant which it was a the person is just as dead!
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Don’t tell me you can’t be accurate one I’ll take him with me when I’m going hunting many times and have killed more than one snake… one of those was at a distance of about 8 feet and it blew his head clean off… I got a phone call one Saturday morning and found out that an acquaintance of mine he killed himself put a 25 caliber to his chest… It did make me wonder if you really meant to do it and why he didn’t use a larger caliber… But the 25 caliber did the job a few years later another young man that lived close to me put a 25 caliber to his head… I guess you have to dance with what you bring to the dance but he too was killed by 25 caliber… So it’s like holding a Yugo if that’s what you like go ahead and drive
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Right, it’s all about application. The best weapon is like the best tool in the toolbox. It only needs to be the best for that purpose, not the universal champ. Sorry about your friend.
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I have more of a question than a comment. Own a Colt 1911 Government (22) and wanted to get a 25. Broke both of my wrists and tried a 380—the swelled terribly. Is a 25 a bad choice for me?
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The design of a gun and how you hold it has as much to do with perceived recoil as does the caliber.
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get a 22 they wont break your wrist unless you need to bomb your body with chicken cartridge first and rebuild a deteriorating bone structure (your body)
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Consider getting a Beretta 32 Tomcat. They’re only available used but I love mine. It’s easy to shoot, no where near the recoil of the 380 but more powerful than the 25 by a considerable amount. The Beretta has a nice feature that you can release the rear of the barrel and remove a cartridge or clean the barrel without disassembling the gun. So clean the barrel, insert a magazine, insert a round in the chamber and latch the barrel and it’s ready to fire without having to rack the slide in either unloading or loading. 6 in the magazine and 1 in the barrel and it’s still light enough to be easy peasy carrying and accurate and powerful enough without being punishing. If I knew where you lived I’d let you try mine so you’d know if it worked for you or not. I know it’s been a year and half since you posted but I’m curious how things turned out.
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i just picked up a beretta tom cat 32 cal ,it shoots 10 times easier then any 380 …..i have a 40 and a 38 and a 9 mm shield ,,,,but my go to gun is a ruger s r 22 ,, i shoot every week with the ruger sr 22 ,, and much practice has giving me the ability to put 2 rounds 50 ft down range in to a cantaloupe ,,, years ago my friend lost his eye to a b b gun ,any round can be lethal.. shoot what u like ,,, ill stick to my 22 .
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The .25 has killed plenty of people. As for the wrestler’s experience, people have been shot with a .38 in a gunfight and not been aware of it. Ignore the folk wisdom.
The reason not to put a .25 in a character’s hand is that they’re simply not very common today. Well made, expensive .25 pistols from makers like Colt and Beretta were once commonly carried by police, or in an earlier era by gentlemen who needed a pocket pistol.
If you want to put a gun in a character’s hand, but you don’t know much about guns… maybe you shouldn’t be writing about guns.
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These girls made good use of one.
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I have I have a Raven 25 and it came in very useful when a pack of mangy dogs was after my pet cat I let him have it and shot three of them dead the only trouble I had after that was now I had to bury the damn things.
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IMHO the .380 is the smallest caliber gun one should concealed carry, especially one loaded with high grade ammo like this:
https://goo.gl/c9xiCn
It is light, fits in a pocket (holster) and is fine for at close range. Same advantages as a .25, but the bullet won’t bounce off anyone’s hand.
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Did you miss the part where she tried a 380 and it caused horrible pain and swelling in her previously bloken wrists? My personal opinion is that she’d be better off with her 22 loaded with CCI Stingers or Velociters but a 32 is also good. It’s my choice because I love the features and it is easy to shoot ACCURATELY. If she tries shooting a 380 again she’s bound to flinch because of the pain. That destroys accuracy and in a self defense situation that is all important.
I used to go to Second Chance Bowling pin shoots and one of the regulars where I participated shot magazine after magazine at the pins with a 1911 in 45 ACP which is the caliber of choice but he seldom cleared the table in the 30 seconds allotted. It doesn’t matter if you’re shooting 454 Casull if you can’t hit your target. A 22 that hits is better than a 50 cal that misses.
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Ive spoken with members of law enforcement who have dealt with homicides involving this particular cailber. One said the bullet penetrated the targets shoulder and bounced a way left through his heart. Ge claimed that calibers like 22, 25 ,and 32 are extremely underrated. If anyone has experienced personal knowledge of this kind id like to know, as I am looking for a vest gun.
But the bottom line is that no matter what.. You’re shooting a bullet.. And the enemy is getting shot.. What’s the difference if they’re facing a LOADED GUN?
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The Departed quotes always play well with me, and I agree. I’d rather not get shot, regardless of caliber.
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Full metal jacketed (target) rounds from a .25 tend to over penetrate and not expand. Defense rounds tend do do the job as intended. e.g.
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.25 naa is a necked down 32 built for North American Arms by Cor Bon. Around 1100 fps and 135 ft. lbs of energy. Trust me that will kill you. Lehigh defense builds a extreme Cavitator round for .32 cal that meets both penetration and cavitation standards for acceptable defense according to FBI cold gelatin tests. So anyone that thinks .380 is the least acceptable is WRONG. If you think .25 will bounce off your hardened outer shell line up and let someone shoot you with a beretta jetfire.
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Most of us civilians live our entire lives without the need to defend ourselves even once. Ignoring and walking away at the first sense of stupidity is STILL your best defence. But… We still understand, there is the infinitesimal but very real chance that someone will get stupid around us, and bar our quiet, humble escape. We DON’t want to fight ANYONE, let alone kill someone. And God forbid if we did have to shoot someone, most likely it would be in a crowded space where a hand cannon would go right through and kill and/or injure half a dozen innocent people behind the perp and spew enough blood and body parts to turn us all into Walking Dead Extras. And if the perp had AIDS, we may have just killed everyone around us. So I made the personal choice to go small caliber for the above reasons. As the article points out, a .25 is probably the least harmful of the deadly weapons. Fine by me. My intentions are simply to stun and/or otherwise disrupt the attacker so that I may make a quick, anonymous exit. I don’t want to teach him a lesson.. or mete out justice. If I HAVE to, I can unload 7 into his head, throat, chest, knees, or groin… And still keep bystander endangerments to a minimum. Yeah, “yours” is probably ‘bigger’ than “Mine.” Its never been my concern. Nice little gun. It has its place.
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Dave, I have to say, you sure got that right. I have permission from my pastor to carry my weapon during services and while he didn’t name anyone he did mention that at least 4 others did too. I’ve never shot anyone and I hope I never do, but if someone tries to shoot up the brethren at my church I feel that person will be judged by God a lot sooner than he expected to be.
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I was at a gun show today. I was buying a handgun for my mother. She is a little older now so I thought, what the hell? Why not go with a Raven 25 caliber. Those damn things last forever and ,unlike like the ring of fire guns you can buy new today, they are actually reliable. I can tell you that in each and every story told to you about how a 25 Cal will only piss someone off………well that person is full of shit. I got shot in the shoulder with a 25 caliber when I was 19. I’m not claiming innocent bystander status, but I didn’t deserve to get shot either. That bullet stopped my ass dead in my tracks. Overwhelming pain and blood was everywhere. I was wondering why this guy at the gun show was telling me that the 25 was a worthless caliber with no stopping power. I was wondering how in the hell he could think that and what information gave him that opinion. Am I that big of a pussy? Much like your friend, I was a wrestler. Not just in high school, NCAA too. I don’t think I’m a pussy, but when it comes to getting shot, I may be. So I go on the internet and I see stories about people getting shot with 25 and just getting pissed off. All of those stories are lies. Complete absolute lies. At the end of the day, anybody who claims to have been shot by firearm, not just grazed, but a full on hit, who claims they weren’t hurt is full of shit.
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This might be my favorite comment on the entire site.
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In 1924 a certain Courtland Dines was shot 3 times in the torso with a .25 wielded by the chauffeur of film star Mabel Normand. Although Dines screamed blue murder that he was going to die from being plugged, doctors said no major damage had been done. All 3 slugs had penetrated his body, and it seems there was not enough power in the .25 to cause major damage. Another friend of Miss Normand had, in 1922, received one slug from a .38, and died immediately, although no major organs were penetrated. Due to the power of a .38 causing trauma? I have heard of guys playing a game where one holds a blanket in front of him and collects 9mm slugs shot by his friend. So, always carry a blanket and avoid film stars!
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With friends like that, who needs enemies?
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I was shot with a weak little daisy bb gun and it penetrated the skin. So if you think a .25 cal will just bounce off and piss you off plz come to my house and let me unload afew rounds from mine into you;.
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Almost forgot Reagan, and James Brady were shot with a little RG10, which takes .22 shorts. Reagan was shot under the armpit and suffered a punctured lung, and major internal bleeding. James Brady was paralyzed. If Hinckley would have been a better shot???
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All guns should be respected. I once got caught in the crossfire of drug dealers shooting at each other in the late 80s. I got shot with a small caliber gun. It hurt like hell.
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That sounds terrible! Thank goodness you made it out.
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Getting shot is getting shot I don’t care what anyone says. Assassin’s use small calibers keeps them on target and with all of the new rounds being developed today don’t bank on surviving a encounter with any firearm, use your head and get out of that situation or be prepared to protect yourself with your own protection. Also, if you injure or fatality wound someone because you missed your intended target you might as well have taken a chance without a weapon and getting shot yourself because you’ll be going to jail for involving an innocent person.
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Agreed. I come down firmly on the side that being shot will always, as a rule, suck.
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In my previous career, I had to pull my weapon four times in a thirteen-year period. Three of those times were to neutralize a threat, all three were with a different caliber of weapon, and all three were lethal. As such, I think that I may be able to provide some insight into this topic (kudos to my friend for linking this blog to me.)
In the first situation, I fired three rounds from a .38 Special M&P Revolver from 14 yards away. The rounds were Super Vel JHP (this was prior to ‘Plus P’ ratings on ammunition, but Super Vel clearly was a hot load for a .38 Special.) One round entered the back of the aggressor’s hand and exited through the front, lodging its way into his left lung. Round two entered his belly and severed his spinal column, and exited into the wooden counter behind him. Round three was wild; it was later recovered a couple of inches to his right. The suspect was conscious throughout the ordeal of waiting for paramedics, but later expired in the ER.
Situation two may be of special interest to you. I was caught unawares, without my primary service weapon, and was required to make use of my backup pistol. From six feet away, I fired one round of .25 ACP from a Jennings J25 into the aggressor’s chest. The round penetrated a leather motorcycle jacket, a t-shirt, the chest cavity, then lodged in the heart. The suspect died nearly instantly. Ammunition was bulk, hardball surplus ammunition; likely manufactured by the Olin corporation.
Situation three involved two shots from a government-issue M1911A1 firing .45ACP JHP manufactured by Super Vel. Bullet one tore through the aggressor’s upper right torso under the collarbone. Bullet two tore through the aggressor’s neck (directly to the left of his adam’s apple) and part of his shoulder. The suspect fired two stray shots from his revolver as he crumpled to the ground. He bled out and expired before EMT could reach him.
These are the three shootings I was involved with, but I could share many more attestations to the lethality of small-caliber shootings that I witnessed after the fact. The most puzzling that I recall was the case of a woman out walking her dog in the woods with her young daughter. The woman suddenly fell to the ground dead. A .22 bullet was pulled from her brain during autopsy. After almost a year of investigation, it was determined that a young boy, nearly 3/4s of a mile away, was plinking in his backyard with a .22 rifle, and a stray shot made an impossible journey into this unfortunate woman’s pathway. It was so far away that the daughter that was with her never heard the actual gun shot. (To make it worse, the young boy and the woman’s daughter were schoolmates, and were in the same class together.)
One last recounting I would like to share with you. A colleague of mine pulled over a gentleman who was under suspicion of driving while intoxicated. The radio call came back as a possibly stolen vehicle, and the driver had a warrant out for his arrest. My colleague ushered the man out of his vehicle and had him place his hands on the roof of the vehicle. He was able to place one handcuff on the man, who suddenly became violent. The suspect pulled out a .22 Short revolver (I believe that it was a North American Arms mini-revolver, the kind that was so small that you could actually carry it on your belt buckle).
He fired one shot into my colleague, who was wearing a Kevlar vest. The bullet entered underneath his armpit, down to his chest cavity. It would have likely exited right above the navel, but ironically the Kevlar vest kept it from exiting, and the bullet actually bounced off the inner vest and back up into the heart. My colleague died instantly.
.22 Short is arguably the least powerful cartridge on the market today. “One step above a BB Gun,” as my father would have said. Yet we forget how many people have been killed by a lowly .22; I recall preparing a report during the Bush Sr administration and determining that something like 80% of all high-profile assassinations since 1800 had been committed with a .22. This was right after a .22 Short nearly killed Ronald Reagan and paralyzed James Brady (thankfully Hinkley was a horrible shot.)
Someone who says something to the effect of “the only thing that a [insert small caliber cartridge here] is good for, is to piss somebody off” has obviously never been involved in an actual shooting. They’re fortunate enough to have never had to work in a profession in which you see the after-effects of gun violence on a regular basis, typically with small caliber handguns. Some of my colleagues used to scoff at the notion that I would carry a cheap .25 as a backup weapon, but (as I often point out) when I asked if any of them wanted to volunteer to go out back and put a couple of rounds through themselves to demonstrate how harmless it was, I never had any takers.
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Thank you for sharing this
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The .22bb/cb cap is a weaker .22 round it uses the primer power only and I’ve fired them out of a .22 revolver and they out penetrated a medium power .177 air rifle in wood.a .22 short is significantly more powerful than normal air rifles.a .25 ACP is a bit more powerful than a .22 short and I’d guess about 4 times the hitting power of a .177 medium power air rifle.now I wouldn’t like to be shot with any of the guns mentioned but I wouldn’t underestimate the power of the .25, it’s deadly.
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This article has some problems.
For example, this statement: “A check of the ballistics tables in my copy of Gun Digest 2015 shows how the .25 is slower than a .22, despite having a larger bullet than the latter. It’s like building a larger car with a smaller engine.”
It’s like building a larger car with a smaller engine? What? No it’s not, it’s trading velocity for bullet weight. They actually have similar energies to each other.
Wanna know another round that has a bigger bullet and less velocity than .22 LR? .45 ACP. Is that like a larger car with a smaller engine? Of course not. It’s ridiculous to outright state that a round is worse because of increased bullet size and lower velocity alone.
The rest of the article literally relies upon pure anecdotes. There are anecdotal instances of rifle rounds bouncing off of cheek bones. That does not mean it’s normal. .25 ACP has penetrated plenty of bones and killed plenty of people.
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If you want to thoroughly research the wounding feasibility of the .25acp you should start in the same place you would with any projectile of known weight, shape, material, and velocity. Ignore pretty much all The anecdotes you might find.
A 35gr .25acp fired from a ~2” barrel travels at over 900fps. That makes it capable of penetrating through vital organs, and punching through bone. A 50gr projectile will travel at 760fps. That is maybe riding the edge of the minimum velocities capable of puncturing the skull, and will likely have problems with heavy winter clothing thrown into the mix. Hollow points would exacerbate the potential problems with both these cartridge weights, and velocity will drop sharply beyond 10yds.
A solid copper projectile or a round with a steel core and grain weights from 20-35gr should be capable of stopping someone when fired from reasonable ranges with adequate precision.
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While it’s, by no means, a genuine manstopper, in terms of fiction writing…it’ll do well enough.
In terms of real life interaction? It would, admittedly, not be the first handgun I picked up if I had a need and were surrounded by multiple options, but it’ll do well enough to get me through if I do my part. The only major drawback to a small handgun is that it normally has a very small frame which can make it a little trickier to shoot well, especially on first experience. My first outings with my .22lr NAA Mini-Revolver were horrible because I didn’t have experience with it to know that 1, it has a “unique” sighting system and that mine printed about three inches low at 7 yards.
Would I prefer a .25 Auto in a Raven as my primary carry? No. Backup? Sure.
And I confess, I have to suspect a good number of the “got shot and didn’t know it” crowd were probably the same people who purport to have sewn up a large gash on their arm by themselves without anything to kill the pain; anecdotal at best, most likely apocryphal. The bullet is a .25 caliber, which means it’s 1/4 of 1 inch wide. (.251 to be precise) So what you’re saying is, somebody had something a quarter-inch wide plow through their skin without them noticing. Would you notice if you were stabbed with a Phillips screwdriver? Or a pencil? Just like the people who were “Sittin’ on the tailgate sewing up a gash in their arm”, I have to remain a bit unbelieving. A lot, actually.
Is a .25 Auto a guaranteed kill shot? No, but neither is a .500 S&W Magnum. You hit a guy in the leg, hand, arm, foot…yeah, he’s not going to die. Sorry to point this out, you can hit a guy in the same spots, or even the “cheekbone shot” mentioned above, even with a .500 he’s still alive because the brain/brain stem is still in one piece. He may die, and he may die because of the bullet, but the shot itself didn’t kill him on the spot.
I love people who knock small calibers though. When I bought my little Mini Revolver a guy at the store was guffawing about how it was “useless”. I offered him a wager; I could load as many chambers as I wanted, point it at the side of his head from three feet away, and if he flinched when I pulled the trigger he owed me $100, if he didn’t flinch I’d owe him $100. He backed down with all the grace of a coward. Why? Even though it’s a little bitty gun and a little bitty bullet, it’s still moving pretty fast and even if it doesn’t turn the lights off permanently, it’s still not going to be a lot of fun to experience that little bitty bullet making its way through your body, even if it doesn’t go that deeply.
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Friend reloads .25 with a lot more powder. it will penetrate a 2 x 4.
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I am a retired Alabama Parole and Probation Officer. In the 1970’s an old medical examiner in Mobile told me that a .22 had a tendency to penetrate the torso and then bounce around causing massive damage. He stated larger rounds tended to pass through, sometimes not hitting a vital organ and not doing as much damage as the .22.
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Makes me laugh. I carry a Colt ‘Junior’ 8 shot antique .25 Auto. Pea shooter eh? How would you like to carch that ‘pea in your eye? Think you’d live??? Well placed shot, that is and always will be, the key. Factory fodder, steel jacket, MY pea shooter went through BOTH SIDES of a warehouse steel shell back door. Get real. I can empty 8 shots in 3 seconds. You see that kind of fire blazin your way you’ll run. Years ago in Pittsburgh a robber got shot 6 times in the back with a .25. Went to the hosptal the next day to have them removed. That doesn’t weigh in for me, I’m not shooting any body in the back. 4 357 Magnums in the back didn’t kill another purpetrator either so caliber isn’t all that. Police training taught 3 careful taps: left chest, right chest, & between the eyes. I also have a NA Arms .22 Mag. I’ve very comfortable with, & a Sig Desert Scorpion in 380. People scoff at the 380 as well as the .25. Catch one in your face you’ll see what happens. Easily concealable, light weight, comfortable for a days carry as a back up.
Not to easy to hide my Glock 19 duty weapon now is it?
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In the Bond clip, it was a 7.65 mm, which is .301, not .25.
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7.65mm is actually .32 not .301.it is known as .32 ACP (automatic Colt pistol). several rounds have ACP behind them;.25 ACP,.32 ACP,.38 ACP,.380 ACP,.38 super ACP (although this has the same dimensions as .38 ACP and could be regarded as the same round although super is much more powerful so although they will fit from a safety point of view are not interchangeable),.45 ACP.
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I suspect the person who wrote this doesn’t know a whole heck of a lot about firearms.
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Something to consider is when the story takes place. .25ACP handguns are far less common today than they were 35+ years ago.
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A little historical research would have helped. The .25 caliber automatic has a record of killing perhaps more people than the 9mm & .45 ACP combined. The Germans shot more people point blank in the back of the head, execution style with the .25 than any other handgun. Some with the .32 ACP , but the .25 worked as well. It is in this historical context, that a spy, who has to hide any firearm extremely well, would choose the .25 & be issued the .25 , as the SOE & OSS did in WW II . It worked, up close & relatively quiet. A knife worked too !
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I am thinking about bidding on a Raven mp 25 this weekend at an auction…depending on the condition of the gun i might go as high as 100-120 dollars (welcome to october 2022)…we already have what we need for firearms, but another one is always a good thing…i know .25acp is rather anemic, the trade off is the concealability…if I get outbid it is okay, I also have my eye on maybe a yeet cannon, or maybe another NAA…and maybe a .327 magnum would be nice…so many guns, so little money…
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